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Post by NO Gimmick Needed on Dec 15, 2010 2:16:10 GMT -4
The concerns were valid, I think, the price didn't quite double, but it was a signifigant increase. The price went up by approximately 46 percent (from 13 to 19). Had it doubled (making it $26) then there would have been cause for concern. I think the current price keeps it affordable, while also updating the game into the 21st century. Beyond the niche crowd people DO snub their nose at the black and white cards. I've seen it happen in person when trying to sell someone on the game. It was a survival move to switch to color, in my opinion. As we've all seen by now, the cards do look great and I think most people will agree that it's a major step forward. I think they're well worth the extra cost. I believe the reason no one stepped forward to address these concerns while this debate was apparently going on in the forums is because Tom Filsinger himself does not respond on them anymore and no one else was in the know about what was being asked. It really is a one man show, Filsinger Games, no matter how many people are enlisted to lend a helping hand at various times. His business model actually amazes me in that he gets so much mileage out of turning projects over to volunteers and continually gets a quality product out of it. But I think he has (wisely) made the decision to step above that message board level of things and let his only interactions with fans in the public forums be in the official sort of press release "Hey the latest edition is coming/is available" position. I think, as with dealing with most game companies large or small, the best way to get a response is a direct email inquiry. Message boards are more of a fan-to-fan interaction thing and, no matter how much work or how long they've been "super fans", I think you were getting fan responses. This is one of the peculiarities of Filsinger Games that I've always noticed over the years. Tom Filsinger likes to keep his face on his products more than any other game maker I've ever seen. It's on the back of the game boxes. It's the logo for his "Dark Menace Productions", it's on a character in his game. He has a flare for the grandiose and self-promotion, which I imagine has served to keep him in business for over two decades. You could make an interesting case for nature versus nurture with that characteristic, and if you've read his book and the part about his biological father you'll know what I mean, but that's for someone else to delve into. Overall, I think the fact that people care enough to be passionate about their unwavering love and/or harsh criticism of business models and product speaks volumes about the product Tom Filsinger has delivered over the years. I've had plenty of games I got tired of or fed up with and I just quit without so much as a shrug. The fact that people care enough to voice concerns is a strong statement on the inspirational nature of Champions Of The Galaxy and Legends Of Wrestling.
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Post by guest2 on Dec 15, 2010 2:33:12 GMT -4
With all due respect Wildfire, you are wrong about several things. I didn't post what I did to get into a big discussion or argument. I posted it hoping you read between the lines and tread more carefully with your assumptions and accusations.
As far as you not having an axe to grind, it's clear you do. Maybe it would be wise for you to try and tap into your moral compass.
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Post by maddog1981 on Dec 15, 2010 7:53:53 GMT -4
I use the pbp sim a lot for my 2087 GWF, that I've neglected all year, and it works for that. It works for that fed because television is all squash matches and I can just run the sim until I get the quick squash that I want.
My main annoyance with the gametable is that you used to have managers and commissioner charts available on it and now you don't. Where did they go and why is it so hard to get them back. That's a key part of the game and it's really ridiculous that they can't figure out how to get that into the game.
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Post by todd on Dec 15, 2010 8:28:42 GMT -4
On thing that bothered me with online was when Martial Law came out the special matches( Street Suicide, Flare Bomb, and Fight The Power) that were introduced with that set were never added. I asked about it a few times on the boards and was eventually sent a message saying to stop asking they were no plans to add these. This never made sense to me if the charts are part of the set they should added along with it right ?
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Post by Guest on Dec 15, 2010 12:08:24 GMT -4
You know, now that I've had time to reflect upon it, I'm sorry Wildfire. I really had no right to question your connection to your moral compass when I'm such a coward I won't even put my name (or even an internet handle) on my statements and accusations. Hey everyone, be sure and participate in GWFZ Territories, because Swarm, love him or hate, deserves $50 from you.
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Post by sickman on Dec 15, 2010 13:25:56 GMT -4
Sometimes conversations hit the weird part.......and there it is.
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Post by Havoc on Dec 15, 2010 13:29:43 GMT -4
Since I know they're reading, I'll state this for the record... y'all are welcome here. This is an UNMODERATED board. Is that anything like 'no pussies will be mods on our board'
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Post by wildfire on Dec 15, 2010 13:33:01 GMT -4
With all due respect Wildfire, you are wrong about several things. I didn't post what I did to get into a big discussion or argument. I posted it hoping you read between the lines and tread more carefully with your assumptions and accusations. As far as you not having an axe to grind, it's clear you do. Maybe it would be wise for you to try and tap into your moral compass. I'd be happy to be corrected.. please, by all means, tell me what you think I'm wrong about. I'm very confident everything I said is true... unfortunately I can't post a link, since the relevant stuff from the old board is gone, but if you have something to say to the contrary, I'm listening. You can even feel free to PM me if you'd prefer. I'm not sure what you mean by 'read between the lines'... you post was pretty clear. If you have something to say, say it. Forcing people to read between the lines is just asking for misunderstanding and misintrepretation. As to telling me to 'find my moral compass' when you're posting anonymously, well, I think that speaks for itself. As to the price, you also have to keep in mind that just a couple sets ago it was $10, and that INCLUDED shipping... that OVER double (if you include shipping) compare to, say, 5 years ago. For me, $19 is high enough for me to want to see it first, rather than pre-order. OTOH, a black and White PDF for $8 or $10 I WOULD pre-order. That was the conversation we tried to have at the time, though all the nonsense. FG doesn't want to go that route, and that's fine, but I don't think anyone who suggested it is evil. I do like that they split up the $59 starting package... I thought that was too much to expect someone new to the game to pay... you're not gonna get to many people to drop the amount of money they'd pay for a PS3 game on a cards-and-dice game.. even board games at that price will contain wooden bits/figures/special dice... something.
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Post by wildfire on Dec 15, 2010 13:35:23 GMT -4
@ No Gimmick Needed:
I think it would do the community good if Tom was more involved... being 'above the fray' for silly board squabbles is good, but CoTG was built on being a small community where you could swap results with the guy who made it, who also was a big fan. There's a certain feel that gives that alot of people like, which is now gone. I think if Tom got down and talked ABOUT the game more, rather than simply doing his Stan Lee impersonation every time something new comes out, it would do a world of good.
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Post by maddog1981 on Dec 15, 2010 13:37:42 GMT -4
$10 was a long time ago. It's been $12 as long as I've played and I've been around a decade now.
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Post by wildfire on Dec 15, 2010 13:39:12 GMT -4
Is that anything like 'no pussies will be mods on our board' Nope, nothing like that at all. there is just NO moderation. I read stuff on the board because I like hangin' with the people here. I'm not a sheriff, nor do I want anyone else to be.
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Post by behindthebook on Dec 15, 2010 13:44:43 GMT -4
Remember when biggest problem people had with the official board was the limit on image size in the signatures and the fact that the auto filter couldn't tell the difference between mustard and tard? Ah, the days of wine and roses....
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Post by wildfire on Dec 15, 2010 13:44:53 GMT -4
$10 was a long time ago. It's been $12 as long as I've played and I've been around a decade now. Really? maybe I'm just an old fart then... I feel like it was only 2119 or so when it went up to $12.... maybe not though... maybe that's just when they cut the discounts on package deals. I don't think that really changes my opinion one way or the other, but I definitely don't remember exactly. RE: pbp Sim: I really liked it at first, but the tag matches are really wonky now.. the tags happen pretty randomly... and far too often. The little things that don't quite work are what bug me...the fact that you can only have a regular match if you click the 'sim this match' link on the card editor... not being able to specific who starts the match in a tag match... I recall there was some issue going from the pbp sim to get the results to show too, though I don't recall what. I actually started a 2087 fed on there a while back, planning to run things like they did in 1987.. lots of house shows with similar cards, TV like the old Sunday shows, etc, but I found that all the quirks made it still take 15-20 minutes to do even a small card... not really any faster than rolling dice and writing the results in a notebook.
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Post by Havoc on Dec 15, 2010 14:24:06 GMT -4
Is that anything like 'no pussies will be mods on our board' Nope, nothing like that at all. there is just NO moderation. I read stuff on the board because I like hangin' with the people here. I'm not a sheriff, nor do I want anyone else to be. So our mod is a pussy then.
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Post by Havoc on Dec 15, 2010 14:26:28 GMT -4
The auto filter couldn't tell the difference between mustard and tard Why would this have been necessary I wonder??
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