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Post by kingwiththeax on Apr 9, 2011 15:30:59 GMT -4
My problem is honestly. My play style tends to be brute force over finesse in these games. I like the look of finesse teams and I like the idea of passing. But really it seems I should take Orc, Human or Lizardmen and just pound on people and do the cage. Instead, I've been trying to open up receivers and pass down the field. And it's not working out for me because that isn't my natural attack method in these sorts of games. Humans are pretty decent with the passing game. But they don't pack the punch of some of the bash teams since they only have 5 guys with access to Mighty Blow and Guard (4 Blitzers and Ogre). Passing you basically have to send guys out for a pass and protect them like they have the ball and then whoever is open run towards them and then throw it. Humans can go in many directions, whether you want a finesse team or with some lucky skill rolls they can become a decent bash team as well.
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Post by maddog1981 on Apr 9, 2011 18:11:06 GMT -4
I did a 1-1 tie. The first half was essentially a stand still. The AI spent most of the time trying to set up a pass that failed. The second half, I grabbed the ball and the opponent sold out coming after me. I used my blitzers to push the defenders away from the edge of the field and then dashed to the endzone. The opponent came back and set up a huge cage. I trapped it in but they managed to push a couple of my guys and a handoff later it was a touchdown for them. I did this as humans vs. golbins.
I'm not sure what I think of the humans. It was nice having the a bit of everything and I didn't get quite as decimated with tackles like I did as the dark elves or skaven. I still felt like I was lacking a little pop in that department.
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Post by kingwiththeax on Apr 9, 2011 18:58:36 GMT -4
Sounds like you are getting the hang of things. Once you skill guys up, you will beat goblins almost every time. They can be difficult to deal with because you have very little block and no tackle to start with so you need the POW on the die to knock guys over. Once you start getting Mighty Blow and Tackle on the team, the Goblin Team gets decimated pretty quickly. Try a game with you as Dwarves vs a computer Goblin team and you will see what I mean. Just the Block/Tackle combination without Mighty Blow will kill that team.
You may want to try Orcs. Probably the easiest team to learn with and they are the most "forgiving" as far as tactic errors. They have almost as much AG as Humans but are capable of a lot more damage. And they have better armor. They just don't really have designated "catchers" for a reliable passing game. But they have access to 5 guys with ST4 or more (4 Black Orcs and 1 Troll), and Throwers and 2 Goblins if you want them. Can really customize an Orc team to your liking.
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Post by wildfire on Apr 10, 2011 10:11:01 GMT -4
For my humans, I send one (or both) catchers down field right away, so that they're in a spot where they can catch a pass and get in the endzone.
That way, if the ball comes loose, a thrower can nab it and huzz it down the field. My catchers both have sure hands, catch and extra movement, and the throwers have nerves of steel and sure hands... works pretty well.
The only games I've been losing is against the really big strong teams that beat me into submission.
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Post by maddog1981 on Apr 10, 2011 10:44:14 GMT -4
I started using Orcs in campaigns. I'm 0-1-1 in my block currently.
The first game was against the same team of goblins. I was in general chaos for the first half and they snuck one in on a big pass that worked. The second half, I got the ball and just slowly marched up the field with the carrier and 2 or 3 blockers. The goblins really couldn't stop me. They got the ball and started to try and form a cage. This time I charged in with any guy I had and just beat them down until I got to the ball carrier. Time ran out as I got the ball.
I lost against a Lizardman team 0-2. The little ones were making some ridiculous dodges the whole game. I came close to scoring a couple of times but the superior movement of the lizards usually stalled me out halfway there. I think if I had a couple of lv. 2 players for this game that I would've done better. I also had issues with the ball coming loose and having really bad options to try and scoop it up. I seemed to get fucked over in this game too. I really wasn't getting the rolls in my favor and the computer seemed to get exactly what it needed in every situation. I literally was pounding on their ball carrier with 4 guys at one point and it kept it's footing the whole time.
One of my linemen got a level up from this game. So we'll see where it goes from there. My giant troll is a real problem though. His stupidity can really kill the middle of the field for me.
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Post by wildfire on Apr 10, 2011 11:43:12 GMT -4
Yeah, losing the tackle zone is HUGE.... my Ogre has the same thing.. it's called 'Bone Head' instead of really stupid ,but it's the same thing.
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Post by kingwiththeax on Apr 10, 2011 17:01:54 GMT -4
Yeah, losing the tackle zone is HUGE.... my Ogre has the same thing.. it's called 'Bone Head' instead of really stupid ,but it's the same thing. Really Stupid is worse......Bonehead is just 2+ to move. Really Stupid is 2+ if there is a teammate next to him, 4+ if there isn't. So a lot higher failure rate for the Troll if he is by himself. There is normally someone around though. But the Troll has Regeneration so it makes him more durable then then Ogre in most cases. Once you start getting Block on the Orc guys that don't have it, the blocking becomes a lot more successful. That is another downside to a starting Lizardman team, even though they have a lot of ST to start with, none of them have Block, so a lot of times you have to burn rerolls blocking with a starting team until the Saurus start gettiing Block. Same goes with the Black Orcs on the Orc team.
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Post by maddog1981 on Apr 10, 2011 17:58:51 GMT -4
I gave my troll juggernaut when he leveled up. So that should make him a little more interesting.
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Post by kingwiththeax on Apr 10, 2011 18:03:58 GMT -4
I gave my troll juggernaut when he leveled up. So that should make him a little more interesting. Should make him a lot more reliable when you Blitz him. Only real downside is you have to roll the Really Stupid roll and if you fail the Blitz is wasted. Also Blitzing with MA4 can suck too at times. Trolls are awesome in the sense they are pretty durable and you can plunk them on the LOS and he can normally tie up a couple guys at a time, or makes the opponent dodge to get away from him.
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Post by maddog1981 on Apr 10, 2011 18:08:12 GMT -4
I've been using my troll to create a giant tie up in the center of the field. If I can do that, I can usually bash through the 3 or 4 guys on one side of the field and march towards the endzone. I'm not using throwers currently. It's bitten me in the ass a bit but I'm not sure if I want to add one or two to the team.
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Post by kingwiththeax on Apr 10, 2011 18:20:03 GMT -4
Honestly Throwers aren't that big of a necessity on an Orc team. They are best suited as a running team. The only thing that they are nice for is Sure Hands so you have a reliable guy to pick up the ball on a kickoff or if he is in position for a loose ball. An Orc lineman with Sure Hands is just as good. Only downside is you need to get 2 skill rolls to get Block/Sure Hands. What a cool combo is for an Orc Thrower is Block/Sure Hands/Kick Off Return. Can really help you get the ball gathered and secured on a kick off.
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Post by maddog1981 on Apr 10, 2011 18:27:20 GMT -4
It didn't really effect me till the last game. Then none of my guys could pick up the ball to save their life. But the PC seemed to be having everything go against me.
My strategy for the Orcs is rush two more guys to the center field. Then start pushing the opponents back. Then gather up the other six guys and start marching. Then as they push into the opponents territory, I will pull some of the guys from center field away and either join my march or block guys coming over to mess with my ball carrier.
I tend to get close with this strategy, I'm just making a few newbie mistakes here and there. I tend to possess the ball 55% of the time on average. Once I start finishing drives, I should be able to score 2 or 3 times a game fairly consistently.
On defense, I'm hit and miss on defense. I tend to just throw bodies at the group with the ball carrier. I tend to leave receivers open and that can hurt me but it seems just as effective to bog the ball carrier down with a bunch of guys he has to dodge.
I bribe the refs before every match and then foul the hell out of everything that moves. A really big ogre or troll, I'll get 4 guys around him and then run up and foul him hard. I've actually had some success taking out the big guys with my troll and 2 or 3 other guys.
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Post by kingwiththeax on Apr 10, 2011 18:36:20 GMT -4
Yeah fouling is a lot of fun. Normally have a Dirty Player Orc lineman to do that, and only foul when it is a key skilled guy or a Big Guy laying on the ground. Once your strategy gets better with more games, the scoring will come. You sound like you are doing pretty well with the change to the Orc team. Once you get the positioning of guys down you will be able to stall against the computer when necessary and score in a timely way, such as at the end of a half where you don't leave the computer any time to get the ball back. Or when you play against teams like Skaven or Goblins who have a lot lower AV then you do, grinding the hell out of them until they are very weak and then score. Nothing like clearing the pitch of the opponents men during a half!
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Post by wildfire on Apr 10, 2011 19:00:22 GMT -4
I rarely have more than 20% possession... once I get the ball, it's usually either gone on in the end zone before the next play.
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Post by kingwiththeax on Apr 10, 2011 19:25:46 GMT -4
I rarely have more than 20% possession... once I get the ball, it's usually either gone on in the end zone before the next play. Skaven are fun for that.....with their high movement they can put a lot of scores up. Downside is they are pretty brittle and you have to replace players quite a bit.
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